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Dennis Khaye
Cat
Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
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 Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 4:39 am Post subject: Double Or Nothing -- DWaP |
 #39262 |
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Double or Nothing
On the eve of his early retirement, a violence shy, freelance bookie must complete two final tasks given to him by the mob boss that's taking over his operation.
- or -
Errol Lev, a brilliant and successful midwestern bookie with secret plans for an early retirement payoff, gets tasks with two offers he can't refuse from the mob as they take over his operation that will lead him sacrifice his dreams and maybe himself.
Cheerfully accepting any help I can get.
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Bryan Reeves
Laza-tiger
Joined: 23 Feb 2010
Posts: 1128
Location: Central Illinois
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:15 pm Post subject: Re: Double Or Nothing -- DWaP |
#39263 |
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| Dennis Khaye wrote: | | Double or Nothing |
Just a couple of quick thoughts...
Give the title your own twist. Something like "Double Down on Nothing", "Double Or... Die" or "Double Nothing". These are not very good, but just a little visual of what to do with the title.
| Quote: | | On the eve of his early retirement, a violence shy, freelance bookie must complete two final tasks given to him by the mob boss that's taking over his operation. |
Not liking this one too much. For brevity, replace "a violence shy" with squeamish or pacifist. I don't see anything in this logline that catches my attention. This is like saying a dentist will soon retire and he suddenly has a couple of new patients. This is what they do for a living. No story.
| Quote: | | Errol Lev, a brilliant and successful midwestern bookie with secret plans for an early retirement payoff, gets tasks with two offers he can't refuse from the mob as they take over his operation that will lead him sacrifice his dreams and maybe himself. |
This one is better. To shorten it, you could eliminate either "brilliant" or "successful", because either one connotes he is good at what he does. I think you could do better describing the consequences in a way that cranks up the heat.
What is so great about his retirement that we want to see him succeed?
What is worth his own death?
Why two offers?
I'd be more interested in the story if you hinted the bookie was going to fix a sporting event (for comedy, get the Chicago Cubs to blow the World Series... after over 100+ years of not winning it) and use the payout from that to finance his retirement. Something counter to what the mob wants to do. You would need to exercise care with that story because you would have to make either the sports authority/governing body or the mob as the chief protagonist.
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"The standard doesn't change."-Mike Tomlin
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RobbRoss
Siberian Tiger
Joined: 04 Jan 2012
Posts: 337
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:52 pm Post subject: |
#39264 |
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It takes a certain kind of angle to make us like or empathize with a bookie (or any shady character) and it's not apparent here. It's a stretch to portray a bookie as a "Dude" in a DWAP, as a dude is an everyday kind of guy whom everyone can relate to.
This doesn't even seem like a DWAP because the sudden, new problem here is closely related to his work. That something complicates his retirement sounds more like a GF or could also work as a ROP if the story is about him finding a better path in life.
It's also curious why the boss takes over his business. A bookie would usually make payments to a boss in order to have his protection and, in a scenario where the bookie does something wrong, would flee for his life. Why doesn't the bookie here leave town? Why doesn't the boss kill him? The objective and stakes are not yet apparent or interesting.
What exactly is motivating you to write this? As briefly as possible, what is the heart and point of the story you wish to tell?
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Dennis Khaye
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Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 11:05 pm Post subject: |
#39265 |
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Thanks very much for the feedback. Really appreciate it.
| Quote: | | The objective and stakes are not yet apparent or interesting. |
Agreed, I see it too. ROP could work really well here. I'll re-work it and see. Thanks.
| Quote: | | What exactly is motivating you to write this? As briefly as possible, what is the heart and point of the story you wish to tell? |
I'm hoping to explore love over gold with this. Love for self, love for others (his crew), love for a girl. Love for self being the one that matters but he doesn't learn it until he loses everything else. Because I think you can't love anyone else until you love yourself. At least that what my marriage counselor keeps saying.
| Quote: | | What is so great about his retirement that we want to see him succeed? |
It's so much that we want to see him retire, it's how he handles the pressures when his well laid plans blow up in his face.
There's this Save the Cat moment where we find out he's been able to keep the mob out and he's actually an ethical businessman trying to do things the right way. He's the complete opposite of a corporation. He cares but he also wants out because he knows the mob is coming (ticking clock) and things are going to get ugly. Think hostile take over.
I see him as a bookie with a heart of gold, kind of like the pimp Djay (Terrance Howard) in Craig Brewer's Hustle and Flow.
| Quote: | | What is worth his own death? |
Not necessarily death as in dead no more heartbeat but more like death of one's self worth. "Honor garbage" as Miyagi would say.
I think of it like a juggler. Three balls in the air. Someone comes along and tosses two more balls at him. Then another, then another. After a point you give up, drop all the balls and run. Unless you have that certain something that tells you to you NEED to keep those original three balls in the air still holding on to hope that you can still walk away from all this clean and able to retire. Something along those two lines.
Rule of three I think. We have the protag's own goal, then the mob gives him two conflicting goals and the three clash in the "Dude! That's a problem" moment. Three storm fronts. I can also play off three goals round robin style better. Were you thinking just one would be better? Or four?
| Quote: | | I'd be more interested in the story if you hinted the bookie was going to fix a sporting event |
I see your point but I really want to keep the protag honest. Honest as bookies go. See above for my comment about this being and anti-corporation story.
All good points that force me to think. Thank you.
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Bryan Reeves
Laza-tiger
Joined: 23 Feb 2010
Posts: 1128
Location: Central Illinois
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| Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2012 12:11 pm Post subject: |
#39270 |
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| Dennis Khaye wrote: | | Quote: | | What is so great about his retirement that we want to see him succeed? |
It's so much that we want to see him retire, it's how he handles the pressures when his well laid plans blow up in his face. |
With everything else going on in your story, I'm not sure his retirement is necessary for the logline. You're using the retirement as his physical goal which is ok. With the knowledge that you want one theme to be against corporations, consider re-writing the logline containing a hint that this is his own golden parachute.
| Quote: | I think of it like a juggler... Unless you have that certain something that tells you to you NEED to keep those original three balls in the air...
Rule of three I think. We have the protag's own goal, then the mob gives him two conflicting goals and the three clash in the "Dude! That's a problem" moment. Three storm fronts. I can also play off three goals round robin style better. Were you thinking just one would be better? Or four? |
The way I see a logline is the opposing force or method is not a required part to include. Think of this summer's Battleship, and its logline from IMDB: "A fleet of ships is forced to do battle with an armada of unknown origins in order to discover and thwart their destructive goals." We don't need to know in the logline how this armada was going to fight the naval vessels.
The mob's x offer(s) is only the catalyst, which you could leave out.
As you said the protagonist has a NEED to keep juggling everything. Give us that need or spiritual goal in the logline.
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"The standard doesn't change."-Mike Tomlin
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Dennis Khaye
Cat
Joined: 06 Sep 2011
Posts: 17
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| Posted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 6:26 pm Post subject: |
#39275 |
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| Good points, thanks Bryan.
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